As an employee benefits attorney at Poyner Spruill in Charlotte, Kelsey Mayo finds the way to “yes.” Rather than discredit unconventional proposals or write off passion projects for lack of time, Mayo pauses to ask herself: “How do I find my way to ‘yes’?” In other words, what compromises need to be made to reach the goal? 

“I like to fully vet an idea to decide whether it’s really worth it,” says Mayo, who graduated from Wake Forest Law School in 2008. “Engaging people in this way — rather than shutting them down — is much more productive, even if you come up with a totally different solution.”  

In addition to serving her clients, Mayo acts as Director of Regulatory Affairs for the American Retirement Association, an organization that advocates for legislative and regulatory matters to benefit America’s private retirement system. 

Despite her packed schedule, Mayo said “yes” to a quick interview during which she shared her personal philosophies on work, life, and balancing the two. 

You are an employee benefits attorney. What does that mean exactly?

I work with human resources professionals, legal counsel, and business owners to keep retirement plans in compliance. I generally don’t go to court like traditional litigators. I laugh that what I do is the much softer side of law.

How do you juggle working with clients, advocacy, and your other personal passions? 

People joke with me and say that I’m a lot. I always laugh and say, “Oh, you should’ve seen me when I first started.” I was very, very driven and Type A. But I’ve always had a strong desire in life to find the way to “yes.” 

Wanting to say “yes” does lead to a very full plate. People ask me all the time, “How do you balance it all?” A more honest answer is that I don’t do it alone. I have a team–both personally and professionally–and I’ll go to them to ask, “Can we do this?” And then we talk about how we can get to “yes.” Sometimes we rearrange work schedules or partner with someone outside the firm. Oftentimes, they find a way to get me to “yes,” and that’s fantastic. Sometimes, we all regret it in the midst of stretching ourselves to meet the goal, but we get there together.     

And sometimes I do go through the analysis and I know it’s not right to say “yes.” For example, I am routinely asked to do volunteer work for causes I’m passionate about, and I really want to say “yes.” But it doesn’t always happen. I’ve had to learn, particularly over the last few years, to say “not right now.” Then, I’ll offer a way to add value or stay connected in the meantime.

“Find the way to yes.” That’s a very interesting mantra. What’s the origin story?

It originated from my mentor within the firm. I had a fantastic partner who retired a couple of years ago. We had lots of long discussions about balancing. When he was counseling me, he always suggested that I needed to say “no” to things. I think during one of those mentoring conversations I said, “I’m okay with saying ‘no,’ but I’d rather find a way to ‘yes.’”

After that, when we were talking about new opportunities, he started to say, “What’s it going to take to get you to ‘yes’?” That would allow me to reframe the question in what do I have to do–to acquire, to give up, etc.–to achieve this goal.

So your mantra is a prompt for reflection?

Yes, and I like it because I’m frustrated by “no” people. I’ve worked with folks who, when you come up with an idea, seem come up with every reason not to make it work. They start with “no.” I like to start the other way. I say, “Okay, let’s think about your idea. What does the idea take? What is the result? What does it take to get to ‘yes’?” 

After being named one of Charlotte’s 50 Most Influential Women, The Mecklenburg Times asked what your greatest accomplishment was. You mentioned handling a situation in which two partners at your firm had left. Can you talk more about that experience? 

At the time, I was a younger partner. I had three experienced partners, one of whom was very part-time. One of the partners, unfortunately, had a medical incident and left the practice overnight. On Monday, we had to come in and take over his clients. It was a very stressful few months. I worked so much. I woke up as early as I could and worked as late as I could. I went to sleep, and then I did it again. But we did a great job as a team and we didn’t lose a single client due to his departure. 

After seeing this very close friend go through a life-changing medical issue, my other full-time partner decided to make a change and retire. So I went from having two full-time partners to one part-time partner in a matter of months. Managing the work during that time felt like being in a hot forge every day. 

Fortunately, we were able to rebuild quickly. My practice administrator and paralegal really stepped up during the turmoil. I hired the partner that I still work with now, and he’s freaking amazing. Our associate has been with us since that time — she joined us in the midst of all of this — and she’s fantastic. And we’ve had other wonderful attorneys contribute to the team over the years. 

The forge analogy is really fitting–it was a tough time, but we came out stronger and built a brilliant team. We are preserving the legacy of the practice for the firm. It’s one of the biggest accomplishments I can think of. 

Wow. During those months, did you ever have moments of doubt? Did you ever question your career path?

In the midst of it, I definitely questioned whether this was what I wanted to be doing. I wondered, “When is this going to end? How long can I sustain this?” But at the end of the day, the firm stood behind me, supported the changes I wanted to make, and I ended up taking over the practice.

What did you learn about yourself?

That was the high watermark of my personal tolerance. When anything bad happens now or we worry about what could happen, I always think, “It’s not as bad as that.” If I can get through that, I can get through pretty much anything. 

What did this experience teach you about work-life balance?

It’s funny because I don’t know that I have a great work-life balance, but I will go to the ends of the earth to protect your work-life balance. The other side of that coin is that when I do sign off, my team will bend over backward to protect me and give me space to disconnect. My team has created a culture of protecting one another. My team also understands that work-life balance doesn’t mean that you don’t put in the time when it’s needed. It means you take the time when you can.  

No matter our title, we are always growing and developing in some way, shape, or form. With that being said, what’s a new skill you’re learning right now?

I’m a very passionate person and I have very strong feelings and opinions. When I see someone who disagrees with me, I tend to want to convince them of my opinion. But I also believe strongly that we should be able to have robust dialogue and not agree and it still be okay. 

So, I’m trying to be sure that when I communicate my ideas to people that it’s with a very clear intent that we’re on the same team–we both likely want a positive outcome. This is just a discussion of how to achieve a positive outcome. You’ll see my point of view and I’ll acknowledge yours. If we don’t agree, that’s okay. 

Who are the people you are potentially disagreeing with?

I’m on our management committee for the firm. We have seven partners who are on this committee and we’re from very different walks of life. We’re in different practice areas, we’re in different geographies, we’re different ages, and we come at things very differently. But, at the end of the day, we all want the same thing: We want the firm to be successful and prosperous. 

I think it’s really important to have strong, passionate dialogue with people who disagree with you and then to walk away still liking each other and wanting to do it again.

Does this want for civil disagreement conflict with your solutions-oriented personality?

It does. Like most people, I’d love it if everyone thought I was right all the time. Who doesn’t like to be right? Disagreeing can be frustrating; it can discourage you from engaging. 

But my law partner has this saying: “You have to remember to question their methods, not their motives,” which I believe he took away from an address Joe Biden gave at Yale. In other words, we’re all on the same team and we want the same things. Just because we have different views on how to achieve those things doesn’t mean you should avoid engaging with someone. In fact, I want to engage more with them because I want to understand where they’re coming from so that I have a better understanding of how to serve. 

Brittney Bogues grew up in an arena. Her father, Tyrone “Muggsy” Bogues, was drafted into the NBA the same year she was born: 1987. He soon emerged as a star for the Charlotte Hornets and eventually debuted in the live-action comedy, “Space Jam.” Meanwhile, his daughter lived and breathed basketball. 

“I grew up hanging out with Stephen Curry,” says Bogues. “I went to every home game.”

Today, 34 years later, her passion for the sport shines through in her “go hard or go home” leadership style. As the owner and founder of Bogues Consulting Group, a PR firm rooted in Charlotte, Bogues believes in bringing her A-game to every ghostwriting project and media planning session.

We sat down with Bogues to hear more about what it takes to be a female entrepreneur in the Queen City and what’s next for her business.  

On your website, you mention that you have a “go hard or go home” leadership style. What does that mean? What’s a good leader?

“Go hard or go home” means bringing your A-game. My team is great because we put our clients first. But we also make sure that we take time off for ourselves and treat ourselves well so that we can give our clients the best product. That’s how I lead. I try to stress work-life balance and team bonding so that people feel supported and heard. 

Leadership all comes back to self-awareness. A good leader is someone who knows what they don’t know. Even though I have my graduate degree and experience, I don’t have all the answers. That’s why I’ve built a team — because there are things I know I don’t bring to the table. 

Throughout your career, you have been very focused on women’s rights. You worked at a domestic violence and sexual assault shelter, for instance. Now, at Bogues Group, you offer the C-Suite Boss Camp for women. What, in your opinion, has changed regarding the culture of women in the workforce? What still needs to change?

What’s exciting now is that more women are launching their own businesses, especially during the pandemic. That’s so exciting. Women have always had passion and drive, but society’s expectations and norms have stunted their growth. 

I’m a huge nerd and love looking at statistics. So, women make up almost 50 percent of the workforce but just 25 percent of leadership. Then, if you look specifically at the C-suite, it’s just ten percent of women. And, if you dig deeper, only two percent of women in C-suite positions are women of color. Those numbers just don’t make sense to me. The math isn’t mathin’, as the cool kids say.  

My partner and I wanted to create spaces and places where women could see other women doing it. That’s where the C-Suite Boss Camp idea came from. This whole initiative is about seeing what you want. And, if you do want to be a leader, having the resources and access to women who can help you get to the next level. We had our in-person even pre-pandemic and hearing from those women was so inspiring and refreshing.

Three years ago, you left the nonprofit sector to start your own business. What can you do now, on your own, that you couldn’t do before?

Let me start by saying that I don’t think everybody should be an entrepreneur. Entrepreneurship is risky and a lot depends on you. You have to be truly motivated, even when things aren’t going your way. But, for me, seeing my vision come to life makes it all worth it. Being an entrepreneur gives you the freedom of deciding what your day looks like — when you start it, when you end it, and how you create your work-life balance. 

You mentioned that entrepreneurship isn’t for everyone. Can you unpack that?

If you don’t have the hustle to endure not knowing if you’re going to get a client and not knowing what tomorrow may look like, entrepreneurship isn’t for you. 

Plus, entrepreneurship isn’t for everybody because not everyone wants to lead. In the beginning, a lot of the work is on you. But as you grow, you have to learn to delegate. You have to learn to create systems of delegation and automation. You have to support and highlight your team’s strengths because that’s what makes everybody better. It’s a collective effort.   

How do you blend your personal passions with your professional aspirations in a way that’s profitable for your company?

Consulting keeps me happy because I’m passionate about many different things. At the core, I’m doing what I went to school for — marketing and communications. But I’m working with clients from so many different backgrounds that it doesn’t get boring. 

I’ve also learned that you want to stay true and authentic to your brand. If it’s not something that you’re authentically passionate about, how can you be an ambassador for it? So, I center my personal and work life around faith, family, and health. As for health, I’ve lost over 50 pounds and maintained it, so living a healthier life has helped me have a healthier business. 

My passion for health is why we’re focused on getting into the CBD industry right now. We see all the benefits of CBD. But we also see all the legalities that they face and we think that more could be done to tell a story about how CBD is changing lives. 

What advice do you wish you could give your younger self?

Lean on your faith and just be fearless. Life is short — you’re not promised tomorrow. So, go after it. Believe in yourself.

Sometimes being fearless is easier said than done. Is it challenging to take your own advice? 

Definitely, but I have mentors in my life. For example, when I started my first business — All In PR in 2011 — I talked to a few people because I was scared. They said, “If you fail, you can still use this as a learning opportunity. Your resume will show that you literally created a business. Then, you use that experience to parlay into something else.” And that’s exactly what I did. 

So, taking the leap is easier said than done. However, the mentors in my life have helped me take action throughout my career. 

Just because you have reached this goal of founding your own company doesn’t mean your journey has ended. So, what’s something new that you’re learning right now?

First of all, I’m learning to play golf. That’s been a fun and humbling experience for me. 

But I’m also learning about the power of learning what you don’t know. So, I’ve joined a forum that meets for four hours every month. During that time, you meet with advisors and delve into business strategy. It’s a professional development opportunity that I’m excited about. I’m looking forward to what that can do for my personal and professional growth, but also my business and team.

You also have your own vlog. Is that something you taught yourself recently?

Yes, I learned that recently. Social media has been its own kind of whirlwind. I’ve been doing social media for others for so long. But now, learning to do it for me has been a very interesting experience. It’s been a great way to connect with people in the community and also with my family members. 

I had my family members record an episode of “Family Feud” and it was hilarious. Vlogging helps me not take myself too seriously. I can be a super serious person, especially when I get these goals in my head and I’m just trying to knock them out. But I’m working on trying to be present. I realized that we’re sometimes on autopilot. So, my goal is to be intentionally present when I’m with someone.

Cheryl Butler’s parents were perturbed by her pivot in her new career. At least at first.

After studying accountancy at Johnson C. Smith University and securing a full-time position at a credit rating business, Butler became restless. She was living the American Dream, but she felt bored and disinterested. And so, after seven years, she quit her corporate gig to pursue her career as a full time cosmetologist and open StudioEast Styling Salon.

“My parents couldn’t fathom the idea that I would leave this job with a salary, benefits, and stability to style hair,” says Butler. “That’s how simple it was for them.” 

Today, nearly 20 years later, StudioEast is thriving. That’s because Butler, a “master stylist,” offers much more than haircuts and highlights. As a small business owner, she feels a certain responsibility to mentor other aspiring female entrepreneurs. We sat down with Butler to hear more about woman-to-woman mentorship, cosmetology, and passion.    

Where did your love for hair come from?

I grew up in a hair salon. My sister is a hairstylist and she’s about 17 years older than me. When I got to high school, I started working with my sister. I would assist her by blow-drying or shampooing clients. Those skills just stuck with me.

Then, when I was in college, I started using my skills. I started doing friends’ hair and those friends became paying customers. I had a small, but not necessarily legal, business in my dormitory for about four years. It kept some change in my pocket.

You earned a degree in accountancy and were living the American Dream at a corporate job. Why did you leave that behind?

I have more passion for serving others by doing their hair than by crunching numbers. But it took me a long time to open my salon. Right out of college, I went to work for a credit rating company called Moody’s Investors Service. I enrolled in cosmetology school part-time a few months after I started that job. Then, after I graduated from cosmetology school, I started working part-time in a salon while still working full-time in corporate America. I did that for seven years between two salons. After the sixth year, I realized that I just wasn’t passionate about my corporate job in the same way I was about the salon.

I could be creative and innovative in the salon even after working for eight hours at Moody’s Moody’s Investors Service. I had a second wind. It was like I was starting my day all over again. My clientele was growing so much that I would go to the salon at 6 a.m. before my 8-to-5 job. Then, I would go to work. At 5 p.m., I would rush back to the salon for afternoon appointments. It was just common sense — I could see that I had so much more passion for hairstyling.

What about your corporate job didn’t jive with your personality and lifestyle?

When I was in corporate America, I enjoyed the people, but I never developed a passion for the job. It was just that — a job. I was crunching numbers and I knew the product. I had even grown in the company, transitioning from an analyst to an editor. But I realized that the job was no longer interesting to me. It was the same thing, month after month after month. It was the same information, the same data, the same timeline. Nothing was ever different.

Another thing that bothered me about the corporate world was that I had to wait a whole year for someone to tell me that I was doing a great job. There was no instant gratification. But in the salon, it’s all instant gratification. When a client reschedules with me, it’s like they’re saying, “Hey, I appreciate you.” When they send a referral, it’s like they’re saying, “You’re doing such a great job that I want everybody to experience what you have to offer.”

Did you receive pushback from friends and family when you left your corporate job?

I most certainly did from my parents, who paid my tuition and put me through school. They were concerned about security. They wanted to make sure I could provide for myself. It was hard to tell my parents that this was what I wanted to do. The saving grace was that I didn’t rush. I didn’t just jump into it. It was definitely a leap of faith, but I planned. I didn’t have to move back home or sell my car. I was still able to take care of myself, and that helped.

My friends didn’t judge because they saw me working so hard. They saw me working two jobs. They saw my social life diminish to nothing. They saw me working in the morning and the evenings. They saw that I couldn’t accept invites for events. Sometimes, if I did go out, I would just fall asleep because I was so tired. But I had a goal and a purpose.

Tell us about the early days of your salon.

When I first started, I was working part-time in a salon as a booth renter. It was a small space for a reduced price. It was pennies — maybe $75 a week. I worked there for four years and then I went to a spa as an independent contractor. Then, in 2002, I opened StudioEast Styling Salon in a 1,200-square-foot building. I was there until March 2020. I downsized just before things closed because of COVID-19. I’m in a salon suite now.

You’ve owned your salon for nearly 20 years. How do you ensure that your business doesn’t stagnate?

In 20 years, I did sustain and grow a great business it was definitely not completely stagnated by the change in our community around us. 

Marketing and branding were an expenditure we could not afford to work without. We ran commercials on Time Warner, annual print ads in the USA Black Pages and a sponsorship walk with “Bottles and Bottoms.  I continually provided advanced training to new and existing stylists.  I offered business training and coached stylist to assist them with growing their own strong clientele.  We traveled to trade shows and participated in community events like “For Sister’s Only” to build a strong team that worked well together. We even sponsored a Live Television show here in the Queen City “Give Me The Mic Charlotte”, I drove for a teamwork environment that would promote our business and better service our clients.  We also used exclusive professional products only that set us apart. Providing a warm, clean and welcoming professional environment was a huge part of our customer service. The environment around us changed over the years. 

I did stagnate, out of fear. I knew for a while that I needed to relocate my salon. The environment around it was changing. There was less foot traffic of potential clients and more panhandling. A lot of people were hanging around and they weren’t always pleasant. The experience that occurred on the inside of my salon didn’t match the outside.

I needed my stylists to feel like this was a place where they could grow. I knew that it was time to make the change. I dragged my feet because the location was convenient to my home and my son’s school. I wish I had moved forward faster.

Small business owners are constantly growing and evolving. What’s something new that you’re learning right now?

COVID-19 was unfortunate overall. However, for my business, it was a blessing. It gave me time to reorganize and restructure. For a while now, I have wanted to become more of a business operator. I have wanted to get out from behind the chair and run, manage, and grow the salon. But that has been hard because I wear so many hats.

While we were home from March to June, I was able to reorganize my business by making calculated decisions. I looked at my time — how much time I was spending with a client and how often the client came to me. I also looked at my products. There are only so many services or clients I can do, so retail is important. I needed to make sure I was offering my clients products that could help them. If they aren’t going to buy hair products from me, they’re going to buy them from somewhere else. I reimagined my business plan completely.  My advice, trust the process, be prepared to pivot, plan, prepare and move forward when the need arrives.

As a female business owner, what do you think needs to change to help more women become entrepreneurs?

In this industry, female hairstylists have more many challenges because we’re mothers, we’re homemakers, and we’re caregivers. We’re more stretched than our male counterparts when it comes to home/work balance in many cases. My fiancée works for himself as well, our work loads are somewhat different when I get off work at the end of the day than his home responsibilities. The long hours and the 7-day work week required to grow a strong business in the beginning is challenging if you have a family and you are a mother. That might be because when women are more focused on business than family, it’s judged. Women support groups and more shared responsibility all the way around would even out the playing field.  

Also, when I talk to people in this industry, they’ll say, “Oh, it’s hard to work for women.” Or they’ll say, “Women are so catty. I’d rather work for a guy.” That’s something we need to improve on. We need to respect and honor the leadership of women in business.